I kiss girls when I’m drunk – Mia

LEAH: Welcome to Good Girls Talk About Sex. I am sex and intimacy coach, Leah Carey, and this is a place to share conversations with all sorts of women about their experience of sexuality. These are unfiltered conversations between adult women talking about sex. If anything about the previous sentence offends you, turn back now! And if you’re looking for a trigger warning, you’re not going to get it from me. I believe that you are stronger than the trauma you have experienced. I have faith in your ability to deal with things that upset you. Sound good? Let’s start the show!

[MUSIC]

LEAH: Hey, friends. Before we jump into today’s interview, I want to share an intense experience I had recently. In mid-July, my partner and I went to Las Vegas for a long weekend. We hadn’t had any time away together since the pandemic started and we were really looking forward to a few days where we could leave our computers behind, turn our phones off, and just focus on each other.

Midway through our mini vacation, I got caught in a mass shooting panic. I was stepping off the elevator into the hotel lobby when a solid wall of people came running and screaming directly toward me. They had heard what they thought were gunshots and immediately started stampeding. It turned out there was no shooter.

The police say it was a broken window. Though based on the way the panic spread throughout the Las Vegas Strip, there was some whispering about whether maybe it was a prank by people in various casinos shooting off a small firework or other noisemaker. It was two of the scariest minutes of my life. And I’m still dealing with the aftereffects of such an intense life or death fear.

When we got home, I wrote the experience up for NBC News and they published it under the title, “What I saw in Vegas during an active shooter scare will stay with me forever.” I didn’t get to choose the title, but damn, they hit it right on the head.

Through the social media comment sections and direct emails, there have been thousands of comments. A tiny percentage of them have been from people thanking me for telling my story. And even a few from people who were also there that night. But well over 95% of the comments have been absolutely vile. I’ve been called an idiot, a drama queen, and a terrible writer. A lot of people have responded with,
“Guns don’t kill people. People kill people.” But the comments that catch my attention the most are the ones calling me out directly and calling me a liar.

Before comments were closed and somehow disappeared on the MSN version of the article, someone under the name Tobin Menard wrote, “This is a fake article. It’s a made-up opinion on what this person thinks they would experience if they were in this situation. What trash!” Brian F. wrote, “1,000 points for things that never happened.” And someone under the name 2^nd Amendment Absolutist wrote, “I wonder if Leah Carey knew how many people would be laughing at her misplaced anguish.”

I’m telling you this as a reminder that no matter what you say, there are going to people who are predisposed to not believe you and to ridicule you. This is especially true for people who present as women, but it’s true for people for all genders. It doesn’t matter how much evidence you present or how many corroborating witnesses there are. Your experience will always be deemed irrelevant or made up by someone who has a loud voice.

So, does that mean we just shouldn’t say things? No. I have no idea how many people read that article, but I’m confident that the people who are making all this noise are in the minority. And the messages I’ve received from people thanking me for my words are far more powerful and important to me than any of the people calling me liars.

I know what the truth is of my experience. So, do you. It’s okay to say it out loud. And it’s okay to not engage with the trolls who will inevitably show up to say you’re wrong, you’re stupid, and you’re lying. You know the truth. You are allowed to stand in that truth no matter what anybody else thinks.

So, I’m imagining this run-in with the trolls as a trial by fire. Because when my memoir comes out, I know there’s going to be a hell of a lot worse. They’re going to judge my body, my choices, my actions, my sinning nature, etc. And I’m going to have to stand in the center of my truth and keep saying what I know to be true. Every single one of us is lovable and desirable.

Okay. That’s all on that subject for now. I may have more to say about it in the future. In the meantime, there’s a link to that article in the episode description on the app you’re listening on now. So, let’s get to the episode.

Mia is a 23-year-old cisgender female. She describes herself as white, monogamous, not straight, and engaged at the time of recording. Since then, she has married. She grew up in a Catholic home and describes her body as athletic curvy. I am so pleased to introduce Mia!

Mia, I am so excited to talk with you. Everybody knows by now my favorite guests are listeners who let me know they want to do an interview. So, thank you for getting in touch. I am thrilled to talk with you.

MIA: Yeah. Thanks for having me. I’m a long-time listener and I’m excited.

LEAH: Awesome. So, let me ask you, what is it about the podcast that appeals to you?

MIA: Oh my gosh. It is everyone I listen to. So, I could relate to them and there were many things where I was like, “Oh my gosh, I was never allowed to talk about those things and here people are having public conversations around these things.” And it was just amazing and I was hooked. I think it took me half into another episode, then I was like, “Yeah, this is the podcast I love.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: I’m so glad that you’re here. So, you know we start every conversation the same way. What is your first memory of sexual pleasure?

MIA: Okay. Obviously, I knew this question was going to be asked. But I was thinking about it and I know there’s a real thing where memories from childhood get blocked out as like a trauma response or trying to not think about something. And nothing ever happened to me in that way, but I just think a lot of my childhood was I just felt guilty around a lot of things.

I grew up Catholic. And I think the earliest thing I can remember is maybe being in 2^nd grade, so I’m 8 or 9 at this point, and realizing that when I rubbed things in between my legs, it felt good. But then, instantly, it was like the Catholic guilt popped in. I was like, “Whoa, you can’t do that.” And so, yeah, when I was really young, it was these things that were like, “Whoa, what is that?” But then, I couldn’t talk to anybody about them and I knew they were wrong on some level early age. That’s really all I can remember.

LEAH: Yeah. So, you mentioned growing up Catholic. So, at what point did you start hearing this message that, I don’t want to make assumptions about what that message was for you, was it that pleasure is bad, was it that masturbation is bad? What was the particular conversation you were getting?

MIA: So, in my household, it was just a lot of right and wrong and these things are right and they get you to heaven and these things are wrong and they get to you to hell. Seriously, up until I was in 7^th grade, I thought that a man and a woman got married, and then just decided they wanted to have a child. I didn’t know what the in-between process was, yeah. And so, I just knew that probably anything that felt good was either selfish or wrong. And so, I don’t know if it was like I understood it was pleasure. I think that I understood that something that felt that good shouldn’t really be happening.

LEAH: Wow, that’s a pretty big thing for a little kid to be dealing with that something that feels that good, I shouldn’t do. Did that go across all things? What about things that tasted good or things that you enjoyed watching or reading or listening to?

MIA: No, I don’t really think so. It was more of like I couldn’t celebrate my wins fully or if I got a good grade, it was just that’s what was expected and you don’t really celebrate that or if I did something good, you’re supposed to be like, “It was no big deal.” So, more things along those lines.

LEAH: And were those the same messages you were hearing at church?

MIA: Quite frankly, I think I blocked a lot of church out. But it was more like how my parents responded to things like if they did something really great at work or they had a win in their personal life and people would be like, “Oh my gosh, that’s so awesome.” They’d be like, “It’s whatever.” And they would just brush it off and dismiss it and we weren’t allowed to really pay any mind to it.

LEAH: Yeah. That’s a lot. That’s a hard way to grow up.

MIA: I tell people that it made me the hard worker that I am today, but I still have a really hard time untangling boosting my own self up. Part of me is very independent and only relies on what I tell myself, but the other part of me is very in need of external validation. And so, it’s just a constant struggle.

LEAH: Yeah. I’m going to go totally off of the timeline here. I know that you are in a committed relationship. And as we record, you’re about to get married. Does that show up in your relationship?

MIA: Yeah. It’s definitely something that we have to work through and obviously, my partner thinks I’m amazing and I think that she’s amazing, but a lot of times, it’s like I don’t really believe her. Not that I don’t believe her, it’s like she tells me, “It’s so amazing that you did that.” And I’m like, “It’s whatever. That’s what I’m supposed to do.” And she’s like, “No, I just want to give you praise.” And I’m like, “I don’t want to accept it.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: But do you actually crave it?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: Yeah. You are speaking my language. I know this exact feeling.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. It’s one of the curses of growing up with high expectations regardless of how they come about, but also not really having the kind of validation you need. So, you said you think around 7 that you started rubbing up on things. How did you discover that? Do you remember?

MIA: I had bunk beds and everyone knows that. You always try to find the fastest way to get out of bunk beds like everyone with bunk beds.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: And so, I remember one time flipping my leg over the top bunk bed and getting caught on the wooden part and being like, “That’s a feeling I’ve never felt before.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, you spent a lot of time getting in and out of bed after that?

MIA: Yes.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: And then, at some point, I imagine you realized you could do that with something other than the wooden slats?

MIA: Yes. I was just thinking about this. Oh my gosh, I’m judging myself. I know no one else is judging me, but the toilet paper roll. I don’t know. It’s just something and it was on my level at that age like the height and that was the next thing. And then, it was like when I was older and had a phone, it was the phone vibration in between my legs. Yeah.

LEAH: So, you had a cellphone or something that vibrates?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: Yeah. As opposed to us old people who grew up with those phones. They did not vibrate.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. Were you coming to something you would recognize now as an orgasm?

MIA: No.

LEAH: How far was it going, do you think?

MIA: I don’t know. It never really got far because again, the Catholic guilt wouldn’t let me get too far without being like, “I should probably stop this before I lose my ticket to heaven.”

LEAH: So, that was seriously ingrained. It wasn’t just, “This is not good,” it was, “This will send me to hell?”

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: Wow. What did you think hell was? Do you remember?

MIA: The stereotypical eternal flames, pool of fire, I don’t know. Anything stereotypical you think of, that’s what I thought.

LEAH: So, if you spend a couple of minutes with your hands between your legs, you are doomed to burn eternally?

MIA: Yeah. I thought once you made one bad decision, that was it for you.

LEAH: Wow. That’s a big load for a little kid.

MIA: Yeah. Needless to say, I’m not in that religion anymore for a big reason.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. So, at what point did you begin questioning whether that religion was a good fit for you?

MIA: It actually wasn’t until I moved out of my parents’ house and went to college. And it was my freshman year in college and I did all of the big holidays, so Lent, Easter, Christmas, all of those things and I did have a friend who was also Catholic who I was pretty close with.

And so, we would go to mass. And then, it was like, “What if I don’t go this Sunday? What I if don’t go next Sunday?” And then, it slowly started dwindling, but I actually don’t go to mass anymore unless it’s for funerals, which is still very important to me and a lot of my family is Catholic. And so, I’m not ready to let go completely, but yeah, in the last year, I set that boundary that was like, “This is not for me. I’m not going anymore.”

LEAH: So, it sounds like it was a drifting away as opposed to a, “This is not something that works for me. I want to be able to have sex.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Because there are some people who I’ve talked to who have had that very clear like, “These teachings about sex don’t work for me and that forms a major part of the religion. So, I’m out.” It doesn’t sound like that’s what happened for you.

MIA: No. I wouldn’t say actively, I was like college kid going to mass like once a month or whenever my family came up while also having sex. But I just felt the guilt, but I was able to deal with the guilt more out of my parents’ home than doing something that I knew was wrong and going home to see my parents.

LEAH: Yeah, okay. All right. So, let’s back up onto the timeline. I’m taking us all over the place here. At what point did you discover that this thing that you did between your legs could actually result in an explosion of energy, an orgasm or did you have one at all?

MIA: It wasn’t until really late. Okay, I guess late is comparable to people, but I think it was like freshman year of high school. It was funny because there was this someone who their whole episode, the title of it was like I got turned on by the sex scenes in movies or something like that. And when I listened to that episode, I was like, “I feel her.” So, I hope whoever recorded that episode is listening to this now and knowing that that helped me.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: But there was a particular movie. I’m not going to say because I think it would be too identifying.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: But that scene, I was like, “I want that. I want to know what that is. I want to know more about that.” And I think that fueled my interest in it. It was like little things, and then people would be interested in you. And then, by the time you’re in high school, some of your friends start having sex and things like that. So, it was probably freshman year of high school that I really put two and two together that this is something that I could achieve.

LEAH: Yeah. I’m super interested to know what the movie is, but I won’t push you.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: What were the things that you saw in that movie that were so intriguing to you?

MIA: I feel like I just have to say it. It’s okay. It’s the movie Love & Basketball.

LEAH: Yeah, that’s a great movie.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: Yes. I played basketball all through high school and I thought that was going to be me. That was my dream, to go play college basketball, find a college basketball man, and we would just be living out our dreams. And it was like the scene where they first have sex and it’s like after prom. They both went to prom with different people and end up in each other’s windows and it’s just so passionate and intense and it felt like the perfect first time. And I was like, “I want that.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. And interestingly, it was with a boy.

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: All right. We’ll come back to that.

MIA: Okay.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, at what point did you have your first interaction with another person that was romantic or sexual?

MIA: I had my first kiss in 7^th grade and it was awful. It was weird and I don’t know. Looking back, I was not interested in him. And I remember reaching out to you and telling you this. That was actually the first and last white person I’ve ever kissed and it was with a boy. And being a white female, that’s why it’s ironic. People might not understand that when they’re listening.

But then, fast forward to freshman year, there was this boy who I had a flirtation ship with all through high school and that was the first time where I was like, “I think I want something more than that.” But we were always just I would say different paths, but that sounds so weird for high school.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, you didn’t kiss? You didn’t get together, nothing? You just enjoyed the presence of the other person?

MIA: Yes. And then, sophomore year, I had my first serious, if you could call a 14- or 15-year-old relationship serious, and that was the first person who hands went down pants, kissing got passionate. I remember the first time I climbed on top of him to kiss him and I thought I was a rebel.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: So, yeah, that was that. The first time I took another step.

LEAH: So, if as a child you thought that rubbing up on something was going to send you to hell, what did you think when you climbed on top of a boyfriend?

MIA: Part of me was like, “I know this is wrong. I know this is bad.” But then, there was a part of me that was screaming so much louder that was, “But you want this and you should try this.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: That voice was too loud to ignore. So, I was like, “I’ll deal with the repercussions later.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: Yeah, meaning my parents or hell. I don’t really know because sometimes, my parents and hell seemed interchangeable. It’s like do I want to disappoint Jesus or do I want to disappoint my parents?

LEAH: Yeah. I get that. I don’t think that Catholicism necessarily does the true love waits thing. But did you have something like that where you were waiting for marriage?

MIA: No. I definitely got that message. I was convinced up until the day that I had sex that I was going to wait until marriage and that it would be this perfect thing and it would be so special. And I laugh at that person now because that turned out to be the complete opposite of how I feel.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, you said the first time you had sex, when was that?

MIA: I had just graduated high school and it was 4^th of July actually. What a strange day. So, yeah, I was 18. I had just graduated high school and it was actually the boy that I had the flirtation ship with all through high school.

LEAH: Oh my goodness. So, it did come to fruition.

MIA: It finally did, senior year. I got enough courage to be like, “Hey, we’ve been doing this dance for 4 years. What is this?” And he actually was like, “Actually, I’m dating somebody.” And I was like, “Okay, cool. Whatever.” And then, the last month of our high school years together, he just kissed me after a track meet, just randomly kissed me in my car and it was like magic.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: And we both felt it, which was funny. And everyone was like, “We knew it”. And I was like, “Okay, whatever.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, how long did the two of you date before you had sex?

MIA: Officially, it was probably less than a month.

LEAH: Maybe date is the wrong word. How long were the two of you in some way involved?

MIA: Three months, yeah. It was like that happened in May. I graduated in June. I had sex in July.

LEAH: And so, you said you didn’t know you were going to have sex until the day that you did it. What changed for you on that day?

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: We were sneaking around before school basically doing everything except actually penetration sex. And I honestly feel so lucky to have had the first partner that I did because I would lead him. I’d be like, “We’re not having sex. I’m waiting until marriage. This can’t happen.” And then, I’d be like, “Take your clothes off,” and we’d be doing things.

I was giving him the definition of mixed signals and he was just so patient with me. And he was like, “Whatever you’re ready for.” And I finally was like, “Actually, let’s do this.” Because I think it was just one of those things where I was like, “I’m not going to be under my pants anymore. I want this. I really like you. Let’s just do it.” He was like, “No, you said no.” And I was like, “I’m saying yes.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: How did that feel to have him not turn you down exactly, but try to maintain your boundaries?

MIA: On one hand, I was like, “Wow. You’re super awesome,” but on the other hand, I was like, “Just listen to me. This is what you want also. Stop.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. I have had a few experiences where I set up a boundary, and then I was like, “No, I’m having so much fun. Let’s just blow past that,” and have had specifically male partners be like, “No, this is your boundary and we are sticking to it.”

And there’s something honestly that is so attractive, so hot about that because as females, we very rarely get the opportunity to push our boundaries because other people are pushing them for us so often.

MIA: Yeah, I would agree. It was definitely very attractive and he was one of my best friends. And it just felt like he cared about me and that he wanted to make sure it was something we both wanted and he had made it very known what he wanted and he was waiting. And so, yeah.

LEAH: Yeah. And so, was that first time having sex a good experience?

MIA: Yeah. It was in a car and that’s not how I imagined it obviously. Being Catholic and thought I was waiting for marriage, but he was just so gentle and, “Whatever you want, you let me know what you need and you tell me no at any time” kind of thing.

And I remember after it happened, he was like, “You should drive my car home.” He was very weird about his car. No one can drive it. No one can touch it. And he was like, “You should drive my car.” I was like, “Are you serious?” He was like, “We just had sex. I feel like you can drive my car home.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: That’s adorable. Was there more sex to be had between the two of you? Did you continue dating?

MIA: Yeah. He went to another school and I stayed in the state that we were in.

LEAH: For college, you mean?

MIA: Yes. And basically, any chance that we got, I actually found out years after we had broken up and everything that his neighbors, he lived in an apartment with his family, complained about how loud we were sometimes to his father. It was just embarrassing to think about now.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: But we just were having the time of our lives before life got serious in college.

LEAH: Yeah. So, up to this point, you have engaged it sounds like entirely with males. Is that correct?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: And did you through this period have any inkling that you might not be completely straight?

MIA: If I look back on it now with what I know now, I would say yeah, there were times. But at that time, my parents would always say that they talked to us about different kinds of relationships, but in my family, it was like people who were not straight were brunt of jokes. And I didn’t really know it was an option to date anybody other than men.

So, I always just wanted to be best friends with girls and there were some girls that I think about now that I’m like, “Were we friends or did I have a crush on you?” And there were celebrities that I just was in love with, but it was because they were beautiful and I thought I wanted to look like them. And that’s just not the case knowing what I know now. So, I really had no idea.

It was actually my freshman year in college. We were at a party and I got drunk and I kissed a girl. I didn’t think anything of it. We were drunk. I moved on. I come home back to my hometown. I was at a party and I kissed a girl who looking back on it now, I had feelings for, but I didn’t know that. And she was like, “Hey, what was that?” And I was like, “I kiss girls when I’m drunk. It was nothing.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: That’s an awesome line. I only kiss girls when I’m drunk. I’ve heard that more than once.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: I truly believed it. That was the craziest thing about it. Fast forward six years, that’s the girl I’m about to marry.

LEAH: Oh my goodness.

MIA: Yes, I know. It’s funny, but it’s not funny at the same time. I don’t know. I almost ruined it by being like, “No, I’m so straight.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: We spent the rest of that time ignoring each other because I was just “drunk and made a mistake.” And she was actually in a relationship, which is the worst part of it, which is why I don’t like to tell the story. They ended up breaking up. I ended up going back to college making out with another girl over spring break. I didn’t remember it though when I woke up the next day and I got like, “You’re the girl who made out with my girlfriend.” And I was like, “Okay, maybe I should reevaluate this.” But instead of reevaluating it, I just slept with every boy that I could to make sure that I was straight.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: So, freshman year of college was good and bad for me at the same time.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: I want to invite you to imagine for a moment what your ideal sex life looks like and feels like. Who are you with? What type of sex do you have together? How do you feel while touching them and how does your body feel when they touch you? Or maybe you’d like to be having less sex than you’re currently having. If you don’t know or if that vision of your ideal doesn’t look at all what’s currently going on in your bedroom, I can help.

With personalized sex and intimacy coaching, we’ll explore where you are, how you got here, where you want to be, and the steps to help you get there. There are no right or wrong answers, just the answers that work for you. I understand that exploring your sexuality and all that goes with it, your body image, your belief in your lovability, and more can be terrifying.

Believe me. I sat in the middle of that fire for decades. I know how painful it is. But I also stepped out the other side stronger, more confident, and more certain of my lovability and desirability and I want the same for you.

I work with couples and one-on-on,  whether you’ve never explored your sexual desires before or you want to explore things you’ve never done before like maybe BDSM or non-monogamy or if you and your partner need some help figuring out how to communicate together so you can have better sex. I’m queer, kinky, and poly friendly and I want you to have a deeply fulfilling intimate life. Together, we can help you get there.

For more information and to schedule your free discovery call, visit www.leahcarey.com/coaching. A new client recently said that before her discovery call, she was extremely nervous, but that I made the experience feel easy and comfortable. So, book your free discovery call today at www.leahcarey.com/coaching.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: The woman who you did not yet know was going to become your wife, was she a lesbian? How did she identify?

MIA: Yes. She did at that time and does identify as a lesbian, but she also had a similar upbringing as me as she didn’t know it was an option and then got to college and was like, “Whoa, there’s so many options out there. And I don’t think I’m straight.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. So, this drive to prove yourself straight, which is not at all unusual, where do you think that came from? Who do you think you were trying to prove that to?

MIA: I think I was trying to prove it to myself and I was like, “I’m in college. I can do whatever I want.” And men were a lot easier to sleep with than women in college.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: So, yeah, it was like part of it was ease of connection, but also I think I was trying to prove it to myself that I like men. I do. And I do like men. That’s why it’s hard for me to pick how I identify because I don’t know if I like both. I don’t know if I just really love this girl, but I might be more attracted to men and I don’t really hear a lot of people talk about that.

I know a lot of people talk about, “I’m straight or I’m bi or I’m this,” but I don’t really hear a lot of people talk about like, “I don’t really know what I am.” And because I’m in a very committed relationship, we’re about to get married, I’m so excited. I can’t imagine spending my life with anybody else.

I’m never going to have that space to find out was it just this woman? Am I just very attracted to her personality or am I attracted to all females and all males in general? My wife-to-be, she knows that and that’s really awesome and she doesn’t need to me to be like, “No, I’m a lesbian and we’re together forever.” But it is something I think about in the back of my mind.

LEAH: Yeah. I just heard you say it’s something you’re never going to have an opportunity to find out because you’re about to get married and that’s not necessarily true. You have all the time in the world to find that out as long as you’re in a committed monogamous marriage that you want to respect the monogamy of, you’re not going to act on it. But that doesn’t mean you can’t explore what your attractions are.

MIA: Yeah. It’s also weird because the females in the media, I find myself being attracted to. For example, Zendaya, I think she is beautiful and I love her.

LEAH: Yeah, she is.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: But my fiancée looks nothing like her. I mean, that happens all the time. People are like, “This is my type and this is the person I ended up with.” But I don’t know. It’s like a mystery. You’re right. I don’t have any interest in acting on anything, but I don’t know. I’m in love with all women. I think women are amazing and beautiful and powerful and I think that is definitely part of my attraction to women.

LEAH: Yeah. I also think and I will speak for myself here, one of the things that was so confusing for me is that we are all sexualized to the female form. Women’s bodies are used to sell us everything from makeup to cars to whatever. And so, growing up as a little girl, it can be very confusing when we do have an attraction to other women to be like, “Doesn’t everybody think that?”

Because they’re everywhere. This is what we’re supposed to enjoy. So, everybody must feel this way and then to come to find out, no, some people appreciate the attractiveness, but don’t have a desire that goes with that attraction. That can be really confusing.

MIA: Yeah. I relate to that because I did realize that everyone just doesn’t appreciate how strong and powerful women are in the same way that I do.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. And none of that takes away how beautiful and strong and attractive men are too and transwomen and transmen and non-binary. None of these things take away from anybody else. And you may or may not be attracted to any particular person regardless of their gender.

MIA: Yeah. That’s why I identify as not straight at the moment because I really don’t know. I cannot have a relationship without connection. I can have sex without connection like an emotional connection. But yeah, definitely not a relationship. If I can’t have a conversation with you about life or you can’t aid me in where I’m going in life, that’s not attractive to me at all regardless if you are to the T of what my stereotypical type is.

LEAH: So, what’s your stereotypical type?

MIA: Like tall, athletic, darker people of color. It tends to be black males or black females with hair.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: When you say with hair, can you clarify exactly what that means?

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: Yes. I realize I should have been more specific. On men, I like afros, fades. And on females, I like dreads or hair you can grab. Short hair, I really like when people have longer hair on their head.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, we’re not talking about bears who are covered with hair on their chest?

MIA: No.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Okay. So, you mentioned that you can have sex without connection and you’ve also mentioned that you slept with a lot of people trying to convince yourself that you are straight. So, what were those experiences like for you when you were in college?

MIA: Basically, anybody I found attractive on any level, I was like, “Hey, do you want to come back to my dorm room?” I remember there was this kid who lived the floor under me and I was like, “We should hang out, but I don’t want to have sex.” And he was like, “Okay.” And he respected that boundary, which was fine, but he was so boring to talk to that I ended up sleeping with him instead.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: So, I look back on that one. I was like, “Ugh, I should have just told him to leave.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: So, things like that. They’re interested. I’m interested. Let’s go. Okay. Leave my dorm room and go back to where you live now.

LEAH: So, were most of them one-night engagements?

MIA: Yeah. Three nights max kind of thing.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: And were you clear with people about that’s what you were doing or were there people who came in thinking, “Maybe I’m going to be her next partner?”

MIA: Yeah. I was not very clear and that was not fair of me. But I assumed that’s what men wanted. You want something without a potential of a relationship until one guy was like, “Hey, you never called me back.” And I was like, “Yeah, I didn’t think I had to. Sorry.”

LEAH: Yeah. That’s a hard assumption that a lot of us make that men just want no strings attached. They just want easy sex and then, “See you later.” And some men do, but a lot of men don’t. And I think they get caught up in that assumption.

MIA: Yeah. People tell me because I generally am interested in connection and talking to people, I have a way of making people feel like I’m more interested than I am when I’m just asking genuine questions like, “Where did you grow up? Did you enjoy it? Where do you see yourself in five years? Where is the place you’d like to travel?” Questions that are just basic for me, people take as, “She’s interested in me.” And I’m not. So, I feel like it’s an occupational hazard because it’s my job to literally care about people so deeply.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. And again, it’s hard to have some of these conversations without dropping into stereotypes. But yeah, it can be hard sometimes to be female and just have a conversation that you think is basic human interest in another person, and then have men who are so starved for real connection and affection think, “She wants me.” And then, it gets really messy really quickly.

MIA: Okay. So, yes, I had that one experience with that guy. But the two experiences that I had were actually with females where I was blindsided that they were interested in me. And we are no longer friends because of it or our friendship started to decline and we no longer talk anymore.

They were two separate situations, but we were all in the same circle. It was one girl who I had come in to college with and we lived in the same floor and we did everything together. And it was so fun and she knew about all the men that had come in through my dorm room and that thing and she knew about what happened between my current partner and I. And then, we get to our junior year in college and she’s like, “Why weren’t you just with me?” And I was like, “Whoa, I did not see that one coming.” And then, things were just weird after that.

And then, the second one was I played a club sport in college and a new person came in and I was like, “Hey, I want to show you around. You just transferred here,” cand just things that I thought every person does for another new person in a college campus. And she, one time, was like, “Hey, we should go practice,” and sent me a winky face. And I was like, “Whoa, I did not see that one coming.” And I asked around everybody on the team and they were like, “How did you not know she was interested?” And I was like, “I don’t know.” And so, yeah, it was hard.

LEAH: Yeah. So, you were through this whole time sleeping with men?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: To convince yourself that you were straight?

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: Up until my sophomore year of college. And then, my current partner and I, we did the thing where we’re like, we’re going to have a summer fling and it ended up never ending.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Okay. So, the two of you have been together for what, five-ish years?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: Okay. And let’s talk about it. Did you still sleep with other people while you were at college or has it been monogamous from the beginning?

MIA: After we made out and then ignored each other.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: Yeah, that’s what happened. That summer that we came home, she had broken up with her girlfriend. I was single. Yeah, I was single, but I was still sleeping with that other guy from high school and she was like, “Why don’t we just have a thing?”

It didn’t really start that way, but we just spent every day together and I was like, “Why don’t we just try it out?” And the first night that we ever got together, it was funny because I was like, “I can’t sleep with you.” We were also drunk. We were drinking that night. I was like, “I want to make sure that I like you not just when I’m drunk.”

LEAH: Wow, good job.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: And I held that boundary, which is so weird to think about.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: So, I held that boundary. And then, the next day, we ended up sleeping together and have not looked back since then.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. So, it’s been monogamous since then?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: And was it good from the beginning or has it taken work to get there?

MIA: So, sex-wise, it’s been good from the beginning. It was actually so sweet. I feel so lucky to have had the first experiences that I did with a man and then a woman. We were in her room and we were messing around and she goes, “Do you want me to help you?” And I was like, “Yes!”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: And she was just like, “Okay, just do what I do.” I know some people will probably be mortified by that, but it was honestly so sweet for me. I was just like, “This is awesome.” And I’m a very big communicator so nothing is really off limits for me.

But then, the first time we were going to take it to the next level, and I was gearing up my confidence to go down on her and I was like, “I can do this.” And I worked my way down there. And then, I was like, “No,” and then I came right back up. And I was like, “I can’t do this.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: Because it terrified me. I was like, “What if I’m bad? What if I can’t do this?” I really like her. All of these things. And then, five minutes later, just out of the blue, I was like, “Nope. I’m going for it.” And she likes to be nice and be like, “It was fine from the beginning at first.” And then, now that we’re getting married and everything, she’s like, “Yeah, you really improved.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: So, sex-wise, it was always just an instant connection. Emotional, relationship-wise, we have had to work so hard at our relationship. It was lust at first sight, but it was not love at first sight. We cared about each other. We were friends in high school, but we had to sit down and decide to take our relationship to the next level that we were going to be in it, we were going to be committed, we were going to love and trust each other. And it was so great that we were able to have that open and honest conversation. And from then on, there’s really nothing that can faze us. Yeah, we have our arguments and stuff, but we’re pretty solid.

LEAH: Yeah. So, you said she’s a lesbian and I don’t want to ask you a lot about their story because that’s her story. But has she ever been with men?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: Okay. And is that something that the two of you ever talk about? Is it something that you have interest in exploring together or is it just the two of you? Are you committed to a monogamous pair bond?

MIA: We have always talked about if we would want to add a third or try that or we would, but we can’t agree. I would want to add a third person in it and be a man. She would want to add a third person in and be a woman. She’s slept with two guys and was like, “Nope, this is not for me.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: And she has no interest in looking back. I’m like, “I could go either way.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah, interesting. I would be interested if the two of you ever decide to pursue that how it goes.

MIA: I think right now, we’re just really focused on us and it’s not a no. It’s just a not right now.

LEAH: Yeah. And I think it’s probably a question I wouldn’t normally ask, but it does seem like you still have some curiosity and some investigation energy in you. Yeah.

MIA: Yeah, definitely. And it’s not like I hide that. She knows. She wouldn’t listen to this. She’d be shocked.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: But she knows that and she knows that I have a very, very high sex drive as she does not. When she does, it’s hot. When she doesn’t, it’s not.

LEAH: And is that okay with you? Is that satisfying to you?

MIA: Yeah, because when we are connected and we both are in agreement, we have a lot of sex. But she also gives me space to be like, “Hey, you do what you need to do.”

LEAH: So, you’re still getting your needs fulfilled even if she’s in a drier spell?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: Good. How do you feel about your body?

MIA: This has been a lifelong and for sure will be a lifelong thing. When I was in elementary school, I had a lot of predominantly white friends that were the stereotypical what as you see as “beautiful.” And I’m saying that in quotation marks. I know everybody can’t see me. And the fashion industry skinny, white, blonde, stick straight hair. And I did not look like that. I was bigger. I was round. I had round glasses. I had a bowl cut.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: Actually no, what was called a stacked bob. Not a bowl cut. So, just did not look like all of my other friends. And then, I get to middle school and I had my first friend who was black and she was like, “Dang, you’re thick.”

And the first time she said that to me, I was mortified. I was like, “She’s calling me fat. This is the worst. I need to go hide.” But she was like, “No, it’s a good thing and you’re white. You’re a white girl with hips.” And from then on, I was like, “Wow, I’ve just been hanging out with the wrong people.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: And part of I think the reason why I’m attracted to predominantly men and women of color is because when I was in middle school, the boys who were of color, specifically black boys who played basketball because I played basketball, they thought I was attractive. They thought I was cool. They were so shocked that I had hips and curves at 12. And that felt good. I was like, “Yeah, I am cute.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: And then, it stuck. It wasn’t just because I got validation from there, but I’ve always fluctuated with like, “Okay, yeah, I’m curvy. But I am okay if I keep hourglass figure, I’m cute. But if I gain more weight and my hourglass goes away, then I’m not cute.” And that’s when it became unhealthy again. It wasn’t like I love my body for my body. It was like I only love my body if it looks a certain with curves. And I know that I reached out to you on Instagram because you posted something about plus-size culture and how it’s not really indicative of all plus-size women.

LEAH: It’s a very particular plus-size body that gets venerated, yeah.

MIA: Yes. So, a long way to answering your question is on a deep-down level, I spent so long not loving my body that I don’t want to do anything but love it, but I definitely get interrupt of, I don’t like the way I look in my clothes.

And I’ve gained weight and the birth control, the freshman weight, the pandemic weight are all very real things and I’m the heaviest I’ve ever been and sometimes, I need to look at my partner and be like, “Hey, do you like the way I look? Am I attractive?” And she always says yes and sometimes I’m like, “No, you’re just saying that.” And she’s like, “No, I love you.” And she’ll start saying specific things that she loves. And she’s also someone who identifies as bigger or curvy and I love her and I think she’s beautiful and it’s like how do I say the same things about her, but not accept the same things she says to me?

LEAH: Yeah. And this will not work for everyone, but something that has been really helpful for my partner because I struggle with body image a lot is that at one point, when we had that conversation, he was like, “I love you. You’re beautiful.” I’m like, “You’re lying. You just want to get in my pants.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: And he showed me the pictures and literally the porn that he watches, the bodies of the women look just like mine. And that was when I was able to start believing him that he actually loves my body because it’s not just that my body happens to be attached to the mind and personality he likes and so he’s putting up with it. No, this is the body he actually enjoys.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: Friends, if you love these conversations, I would love your help to keep them going. There are three ways you can participate. Two are free and one is for listeners who’ve got a few extra dollars each month.

Number one, take a screenshot of this episode right now and post it to your Instagram stories. Tag me in your post and if it’s public, I’ll reshare and send you a personal thank you. Word of mouth is the best way to build buzz for an independent show like Good Girls Talk About Sex. And the more people listening, the healthier our collective sexual experiences will become.

Number two, don’t want the whole world to know you’re listening to a show about sex? I get it. Perhaps you heard something in this episode that reminds you of a past conversation with a friend or something you wish your partner knew. Send them a link to this episode and a quick message about why you think they should listen.

And number three, if you have the resources to support the sex positive work I do, I’d be grateful for your support at Patreon. Donating the equivalent of a fancy cup of coffee each month might not make a big difference to you, but it makes a huge difference to me. There’s absolutely no contract or obligation. You can cancel it any time, plus I donate 10% of all proceeds to ARC-Southeast, an organization that supports women in the Southeast United States to access reproductive services that are currently being legislated out of existence. It’s easy to become a patron at www.patreon.com/goodgirlstalkaboutsex.

And one more thing, there is a treasure trove of additional audio at Patreon that’s free for everyone. You don’t even need to have a Patreon account to access them. Just go to www.patreon.com/goodgirlstalkaboutsex to start listening. I appreciate every one of you whether you’re a client, a patron, a social media follower or a silent listener. I trust you to know what’s right for you. Thank you for being here. Now, let’s get back to the show.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: What questions or concerns do you have about sex or your sex life?

MIA: So, we’re both in the same profession. Our jobs are stressful and they’re hard. And we spend all day worrying about other humans and it’s hard to muster up the energy to have sex sometimes or to have connection. And we go through periods of time where we come home and we just zone out because our day was incredibly hard.

And it’s like we need to start finding little ways to connect. We try to eat dinner once a week without the TV and put limits on our phone, but to me, sex and intimacy are different and we need to find more ways to be more intimate that don’t require a ton of time and energy. And I know that you talk a lot about that, but that’s one concern I have and I’m always looking for advice and feedback and all those kinds of things.

LEAH: Yeah. I’m glad that you recognize how difficult things are especially right now. And in your caring profession, this is even ten times harder. So, first of all, I would not want you to put more stress on yourself in order to create this whole new or other thing that you have to put energy into. Do the two of you cuddle when you’re watching TV?

MIA: Mm-hmm.

LEAH: And od you have your clothes on or off when you cuddle?

MIA: On.

LEAH: So, you might want to experiment some with cuddling with your shirts off or cuddling nude because that skin-to-skin contact can be really helpful to regulating each of your nervous systems and helping you to feel really connected.

So, it’s not necessarily about adding new activities into your world, but taking the activities that you’re already doing and finding ways to help them keep you more connected. I would not want you to shame yourself for watching TV and being like, “We should watch less TV.” For some of us, TV is a godsend. I don’t know if I would have made it through these last couple of years without TV. And thank God, my partner enjoys watching too. And so, we spend a huge amount of our time just watching TV and cuddling mostly nude because that is really incredible to me to have that skin-to-skin contact.

MIA: I love that. This is why I love your podcast and you because I do put so much stress on myself. I’m like, “We should be watching less TV. We should be having more connection time where we’re just staring at each other.”

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: But sometimes, that’s just not the reality. Deescalating another human somedays, I can’t come home and put any more energy into anything else I do for that day.

LEAH: Yes. I mean one of the things that makes me most irritated in the world is when people are unwilling to recognize the reality of a situation. The reality is you are stressed out. You don’t have a ton of energy. So, putting more stress and requirements for more energy output on you is unreasonable. So, let’s find ways that will work for you within the limits and confines that you’ve got.

MIA: That sounds good.

LEAH: All right, cool.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: And now, it’s time for the lowdown, the things we’re dying to know, but would usually be too polite to ask any good girl.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: Do you have sex during your period?

MIA: Sometimes.

LEAH: What’s the difference or what allows you to sometimes?

MIA: I think I’m more comfortable with it than my partner is. But if we have access to other sex toys like a strap or something like that, I think we’re more willing when it’s not our own body parts.

LEAH: So, having two people with periods in the same relationship can be a challenge. Do your cycles sync up or do you have two separate weeks each month?

MIA: For the first time in six years, we just synced up and it was awful.

[LAUGHTER]

MIA: I always thought that that’s what I wanted, but after last week, I was like, “No, I do not want that anymore.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: All right. You mentioned straps. Do the two of you use strap-ons?

MIA: Yes. Sometimes, I think we really enjoy just connection between each other, but sometimes we just need a little extra and we also enjoy that extra thing that we get from that.

LEAH: Do you have one strap-on that both of you use or do you have two separate straps?

MIA: We just have one. And up until a year ago, I was predominantly the only one who received, but I not kept pushing in a respectful, way but I was like, “Just try it, just try it, just try it.” And finally, she let me and she was like, “Actually, this was not as bad as I thought it was going to be.” And I was like, “See?”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Did she think it was going to have too much of overlay of heterosexual sex for her?

MIA: Yeah. I think that’s what she’s terrified of because she’s like, “I did not like that. I don’t want that. That’s not me.”

LEAH: And in fact, heterosexual sex is a completely different thing. Penetration for the sake of penetration can happen with anybody.

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: Yeah. What’s the approximate number of sex partners you’ve had?

MIA: Ten plus.

LEAH: Have you ever had sex with someone with a different racial identity than your own?

MIA: Yes. Actually, predominantly.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: What’s your favorite sex toy?

MIA: Vibrators that have both the inside penetration and the clit stimulation. I don’t know if there’s a specific term for that.

LEAH: Sometimes, they’re called rabbits, but there are lots of different versions of that. So, internal and external stimulation, yeah. What’s your favorite sex position?

MIA: I don’t know. I like anything that really allows for the other person to go deep, so maybe doggystyle or sitting on my partner while they’re seating in a chair, anything like that, yeah.

LEAH: When you say it allows your partner to go deep and there are going to be people who hear this and think, “But neither of them has a penis,” what does that mean?

MIA: Yeah. So, with the strap. So, when she’s wearing it and I’m receiving.

LEAH: Do you use the strap most times that you have sex?

MIA: No. We actually don’t. I would say when we’re both not stressed out, probably two to three times a week. When we’re stressed out, it’s probably once a week and I would say if we’re going with a lower number, we’d probably use it one out of four times. Was that 25%?

LEAH: Good job.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you prefer to initiate or for your partner to initiate?

MIA: I am a control freak that loves when other people initiate. So, that’s a very hard question.

LEAH: I get it.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Are you generally more active or more passive during lovemaking?

MIA: Active, even though my partner would love if I was more passive.

LEAH: Really?

MIA: Yes. She would want to be in control and I’m like, “I can’t let go of control.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you ever play with things like restraints?

MIA: Yes.

LEAH: And does she enjoy having you restrained?

MIA: Yeah, it’s her favorite thing.

LEAH: And what do you feel about it?

MIA: I like it because I’m very much a tactile, I need all my senses. If one’s taken away, I feel like another one gets heightened. And I love it.

LEAH: Do you prefer clit stimulation or penetration?

MIA: Clit stimulation.

LEAH: Do you enjoy G-spot stimulation?

MIA: Yes. I’m going to go with yes.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you know where your G-spot is?

MIA: Yeah. It’s like when you do that come here motion, is that what people say with your fingers?

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. The reason I ask is because it seemed like you weren’t sure if you liked it, so I was wondering if you were trying to convince yourself that maybe you did.

MIA: I do with fingers. I don’t know or I didn’t realize it was being hit with the strap. I don’t know. But if it’s too intense, then I don’t like it and that’s why I would say with fingers and not with a vibrator or something like that.

LEAH: Got you. Do you enjoy having your breasts played with?

MIA: Yes, I do.

LEAH: Do you think it’s generally easy or challenging for you to orgasm?

MIA: It’s hard. I am a human that works with other humans who are constantly on my mind and I have a really hard time getting anything out of my head. And so, it can be the best sex in the world, but I’m like, “Is that person okay? Did I do enough?”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah, I get that. Have you ever faked an orgasm?

MIA: I have faked intensity of one, so pretended it was this big thing when it was just like, “It happened.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Got it. Do you prefer the orgasm from masturbation or from sex with another person?

MIA: I shouldn’t apologize for explaining. I like the orgasm with the intensity with masturbation, but I like the build-up with another person.

LEAH: Okay. What’s your favorite thing to do to a partner during sex play?

MIA: I like getting on top of my partner and pinning her down while kissing her.

LEAH: What kind of touch do you enjoy receiving the most?

MIA: Hard. I like to be pinned up against walls and not thrown around, but I like more aggressive movements.

LEAH: What are your hard red lines?

MIA: The stereotypical blood, bodily fluids, that kind of thing, but also anal.

LEAH: Yeah, okay. How do you feel about porn?

MIA: I don’t hate it. I used to watch it more, but now I prefer to watch sex scenes in movies over porn.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. Do you know why?

MIA: Not that I can relate to the people in movies, but I feel like I can relate to people in movies more than I can relate to people in porn videos.

LEAH: Yeah. I also enjoy sex scenes in movies more than I enjoy porn and I think it’s because in porn, it’s just like, you show up, you show up, bang. Whereas in a movie, I can really get into the connection between the characters.

MIA: Yes. And I was listening to an episode where you talked about porn and you were like, “You should pay for your porn.” And you linked it at the bottom of an episode. And I tried to go back and I tried to find that, but I couldn’t. And so, I was wondering if maybe you could send that to me personally or link that somewhere else because I have tried to find that link for forever.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yes. There are a number of people who make “feminist” or “ethical” porn where they pay their performers as they should where there’s no coercion, where people are taken care of. And yeah, I will definitely put those links into the show notes. I will send them to you. And also if you’re interested in listening to stories, Dipsea is a really great audio erotica. Yeah, I’ll send you all that information.

MIA: Awesome.

LEAH: What’s your ideal frequency of sex?

MIA: At least once a week. Probably if I’m just not stressed and have all the free time in the world like three times a week.

LEAH: Yeah. Do you have hair down there or are you bare?

MIA: I was really thinking about how I was going to answer this question because I don’t want anybody to judge me. I prefer not to shave. I hate shaving. I don’t want it, but also, have a partner who prefers when I do shave. And she’s never been like, “You have to shave or we’re not having sex,” but she’s like, “That is a preference I have and it’s not like I won’t, I just want you to know, that we can both enjoy more when you do.” And so, I usually shave.

LEAH: And do you enjoy it more when you are shaved?

MIA: I worry less, which is nice and I also do think that the intensity at which things happen from her, yes, is nice.

LEAH: Interesting, yeah. I think that there are compromises that you make and if that’s one of the ones you’ve decided to make, there’s no shame in that at all.

MIA: Yeah. I used to think that if I shave that, I wasn’t a feminist and I wasn’t standing up for myself, but in reality, we’re partners. We have to make decisions together. If I didn’t shave, she literally wouldn’t care. It is just a preference that she has and something that I want to do, now I can say I always want to do because I care about if we both enjoy what we’re doing.

LEAH: Yeah. Have you ever had a threesome or more?

MIA: No.

LEAH: Do you enjoy giving oral sex?

MIA: I do.

LEAH: Do you enjoy receiving oral sex?

MIA: I enjoy that more, yes.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you ever worry about your smell or taste?

MIA: I used to more with males than with my current partner. I just am self-conscious about down there in general.

LEAH: Yeah. How do you feel about ass play?

MIA: No, never done it. Yeah.

LEAH: What do you consider the “kinkiest” thing you enjoy given that we all have a completely different scale for what’s kinky?

MIA: I like to be tied up and I like to be choked, but sometimes I’m like, “I can’t breathe. You got to readjust.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: And do you have a signal?

MIA: I’ll just move her hand. It’s like not super intense. It’s just more of a grab than a choke.

LEAH: And do you have a safety protocol in place where if something were to go sideways?

MIA: No, we do not.

LEAH: Okay. So, let me get up on this particular soap box one more time.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Choking, if you enjoy it, I’m not going to tell you not to do it, but you do need to know that is the most high-risk activity outside of rope play. They are the two highest high-risk activities. And when it goes wrong, it goes wrong very, very fast and there’s not time to make a plan or figure things out. So, the two of you need to have a conversation. And yes, I am putting it in terms of you need to.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Because this is important. You need to have a conversation about how you’re going to handle it if something goes sideways, whether it’s calling 911, whether it’s having smelling salts, whatever it is, you need to have that conversation. And ideally, you write it down on a sticky or an index card and you put it beside the bed so that if you get into an emergency situation, the person who’s still conscious doesn’t have to try to remember. They can just look at the card and do the thing. Okay?

MIA: That makes a lot of sense.

LEAH: Lecture over.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: I get concerned not about the activity itself, but the fact that it has become so common that people think they don’t need to have safety protocols when in fact it’s really important.

MIA: Yeah. That’s why I say it’s not super intense when we do it. It’s never for a super long period of time. We’ve never even been close to needing a safety procedure, but if it ever did get past the point where we do now.

LEAH: Yeah. And the thing is you never know what works today could for whatever reason go catastrophically wrong tomorrow. Because bodies are weird.

MIA: They are, yeah.

LEAH: Yeah. So, just be safe on the front-end. Okay. Do you enjoy dirty talk during sexual encounters?

MIA: Yes, I do and so does my partner, but I never know what to say. And so then, sometimes we just laugh, which is we love laughing during sex. We think that means that we’re connecting and having a good time.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. This is a great place for erotica for listening to Dipsea stories for reading erotica online, so you can get a sense of what the words are you. You might want to say you’re not starting from a blank page.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Have you ever felt a sexual urge that confused you?

MIA: Yeah. The first time I liked a woman, the first time I wanted to hook up with my current partner.

LEAH: Yeah. What’s your favorite part of your body?

MIA: I love my hips.

LEAH: I love that. I think you may be the first person to ever say that.

MIA: Yeah. I spent so long hating them and now I just realize they do much for me and I love them.

LEAH: Awesome. What’s your least favorite part of your body?

MIA: My stomach.

LEAH: You are not the first person who said that.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. What is something about your current sex life that isn’t quite as satisfying as you’d like it to be?

MIA: I just think sometimes with my partner, I feel self-conscious and I’m a very confident person. And I just wish I could give her some of my confidence and I think if we both were just super confident and I know we feel comfortable with each other, but if we’re 200% comfortable each other, then we could have some very amazing sex.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: What belief did you have about sex as a child or teenager that you wish you could go back and correct her on now?

MIA: That women can have sexual desires and that just because you enjoy having sex doesn’t mean that you’re a slut or enter any term that’s ever been said about women who say they enjoy having sex.

LEAH: And you’re not going to hell?

MIA: Yeah, that too.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. Mia, this has been so wonderful. Thank you for having this conversation with me.

MIA: Yeah. Thank you so much for having me on. I am just so ecstatic that you said, “Yes, let’s do it.”

[LAUGHTER]

[MUSIC]

LEAH: That’s it for today. Before we go, I want to remind you that the things you may have heard about your sexuality aren’t true. You are worthy. You are desirable. You are not broken. As a sex and intimacy coach, I will guide you in embracing the sexuality that is innately yours no matter what it looks like.

To set up your free discovery call, go to www.leahcarey.com/coaching. If you have questions or comments about anything you’ve heard on the show, call and leave a message at 720-GOOD-SEX. Full show notes and transcripts for this episode are at www.goodgirlstalk.com/ and you can follow me on @goodgirlstalk on the socials for more sex positive content.

If you’re enjoying this show, please take a moment to leave a 5-star rating and review on Apple Podcasts or if you’re using another podcast app, go to www.ratethispodcast.com/goodgirls. While listening to this show is free, producing it is not. If my work is meaningful to you and you have a few dollars to support it each month, I will gratefully accept your patronage at Patreon. Find out more and become a community member at www.patreon.com/goodgirlstalkaboutsex.

Good Girls Talk About Sex is produced by me, Leah Carey, and edited by Gretchen Kilby. I have additional administrative support from Lara O’Connor. Transcripts are produced by Jan Acielo. Until next time, here’s to your better sex life!

[MUSIC]