I was a really horny kid – Carla

A horny ex-Catholic joins us from the Netherlands to give us the low-down on how living in a liberal country but growing up in an oppressive family gave her all sorts of mixed-up and downright wrong messages. It’s something like a double-negative version of universes colliding to form new yeses. She’s now a mother of five, and currently balancing sex and motherhood and an unconventional family arrangement.

Good Girls Talk About Sex
Good Girls Talk About Sex
I was a really horny kid - Carla
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In this episode we talk about

  • Consent
  • Repressive family culture
  • Body image
  • Infidelity vs non-monogamy
  • Sex after kids
  • Breast play and breastfeeding
  • Hetero-flexible/bi-curious

Full episode text

LEAH: Welcome to Good Girls Talk About Sex. I am sex educator and sexual communication coach, Leah Carey, and this is a place to share conversations with all sorts of women about their experience of sexuality. These are unfiltered conversations between adult women talking about sex. If anything about the previous sentence offends you, turn back now! And if you’re looking for a trigger warning, you’re not going to get it from me. I believe that you are stronger than the trauma you have experienced. I have faith in your ability to deal with things that upset you. Sound good? Let’s start the show!

[MUSIC]

LEAH: Hey, friends. I love talking to people from other countries because even among English-speaking countries, cultural attitudes about sex can be wildly different. That’s why I was thrilled when today’s guest contacted me and said she wanted to do an interview from the Netherlands. Carla is a 45-year-old cisgender woman who describes herself as black, heteroflexible, and partnered. She has five children and she said her preferred relationship style is, “If we talk about it and we’re on the same page, it’s okay.” I got to tell you. I love that description. Carla also describes her body as soft. I’m so pleased to introduce Carla!

Carla, welcome. I’m so excited to talk with you. You reached out to me and said, “I might like to do an interview, but different time zones and different countries.” I was like, “No, I love talking to people in other countries. Please let’s do this!”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, I’m glad that you’re here.

CARLA: Yeah. Thank you for having me.

LEAH: You’re welcome. So, let’s start where I start every conversation. What is your first memory of sexual pleasure?

CARLA: I think it was, I don’t know, can I say a brand of cigarette?

LEAH: Sure.

CARLA: Yeah. The Marlboro man with the cowboy hat.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: And I’ve always had a thing for men that smoke and cowboys. So, I think it started with him.

LEAH: Yeah. How old were you?

CARLA: I’m not sure because my dad used to smoke and he would smoke another brand, the one with the camel on it. I must have been, I don’t know, maybe 8.

LEAH: Yeah. And when you saw him, what happened for you? What was that sense of pleasure or attraction that happened for you?

CARLA: I don’t know. It was like a deer staring in the headlights. I was like, oh my god. Who was that?

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: We didn’t watch that much TV growing up because we were always playing. There was just one TV in the house. And my dad, he used to watch a lot of television or watch movies with us. And the Netherlands isn’t like America. We didn’t have commercials every five minutes. We would have maybe one or two commercial breaks in a movie. So, I didn’t see the Marlboro man a lot, just a few times.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, you just mentioned you’re in the Netherlands. You grew up Dutch. So, can you tell me a little bit about how sex is talked about and how parents or schools might talk about sex with kids?

CARLA: Growing up, you would get sex ed, maybe 10, 11 years old. And they would explain everything to you and that was good because my mom did not. And my father, he was just always working. So, he wasn’t home. And I had a lot of Dutch white friends and they would take me to the library and I would read upon everything.

And if I’d asked my mom, “What is this or why do I have this feeling? What’s going on?” she would get angry and sex shame us for asking those questions. She’d be like, “You know more than me, so why are you asking that?” Yeah. And the parents of my white friends, they were really open and they would explain everything. And that’s how I got my education because I had an older sister and she didn’t know. My mom wouldn’t tell her. So, she was like, “I don’t know.”

LEAH: Wow. So, she didn’t go out and learn on her own?

CARLA: No. she was born in the Caribbean islands and lived in Portugal and she came to us at 14. So, she had to learn a whole new language. Everything was new to her and she had these little sisters running around and she was going through puberty herself. So, it was hard on her also.

LEAH: Yeah. Was she adopted? Was she a member of the family?

CARLA: She was my half-sister, yeah.

LEAH: Half-sister, okay.

CARLA: And the age difference is 14 years. So, she was 14 and I was 3 months old.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Wow, okay. So, by the time you got to 8 or 9 or 10, was she already out of the house?

CARLA: Yeah. She was gone, yup.

LEAH: So, you didn’t have that big sister thing where you could go to her and ask questions?

CARLA: No because she would be very embarrassed if I’d ask her stuff. I remember one time, she had a period and I said, “Look at you, you’re bleeding.” And she’s like, “No, don’t say those things.” And she walked away. And I was like, okay, what happened?

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. And so, were there other siblings in the house?

CARLA: Yeah. My mom had four girls.

LEAH: Wow, that’s a lot of estrogen.

CARLA: A lot of pads and tampons too.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: I don’t know if your older sister’s included in those four.

CARLA: Yeah, she was included. Yeah, but I’m the oldest of the three she had while married to my dad.

LEAH: So, you said that you had good sex education in the Netherlands. And I’m always curious to know exactly what that means to people. And I do know that in your part of the world, sex education tends to be much more robust than it is here in the United States. So, I assume you talked a lot about bodies and how they work and how sex works and how reproduction works. Did they also talk to you about how to have healthy relationships and consent and conversations, things like that?

CARLA: No. It was just sex. If you do this, this can happen. And they will talk about gay sex and stuff like that, but nothing about boundaries, nothing about consent. I had to learn along the way.

LEAH: Yeah. So, in the United States, we’re just barely catching up to where you were 30 years ago.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: We’re still in a lot of trouble here with consent. Something happened on the show where people sing and they can, I don’t know, win a contract. And there’s been a lot of abuse behind the cameras and it’s now just resurfaced and people are talking about it. So, consent is still something that a lot of men don’t understand. They get angry. So, I can’t stay anything anymore to a woman. So, I can’t even give a compliment, stuff like that. They don’t understand.

LEAH: Yeah. So, you also mentioned before we started talking that you were part of the Catholic church growing up. What kinds of messages were you getting in church about sexuality and being female?

CARLA: Nothing.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, they didn’t talk about it at all?

CARLA: No, not once.

LEAH: I wonder if that’s better than being shamed for it or if it just left such a vacuum that that also was a problem for you.

CARLA: I just stopped going to church at a certain age because I was asking too many questions. I was like, “Yeah, why can all these men have more than one wife and why can’t women have more than one husband?” Stuff like that and people were like, “You’re way too nosy, Carla.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: How old were you?

CARLA: Maybe 8 or 9.

LEAH: Wow, young.

CARLA: Yeah. But then, my innocence because I was also a very dreamy child. I would see something on TV and I’d just ask and my mom would get really angry with me. So, I stopped asking her stuff and I would just ask the parents of my friends and they would answer. I would get a lot of answers from them.

LEAH: Good. When your mom got angry, what kinds of things would she say to you?

CARLA: She told me to go away or good girls don’t ask those things.

LEAH: Yeah, I hear that.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: And she would be slut shaming people, “Look at her. She has so many different men,” and blah, blah, blah, stuff like that. And things I didn’t even think about them because she would never talk about them. And I’d be like, “How do you know about all the men she has?”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Was there a point at which you discovered masturbation?

CARLA: Yeah. I think around 12.

LEAH: Do you remember how that happened for you?

CARLA: I don’t remember how, but I think I was watching Sky Channel or some of the German channels because they had the good movies. And in a movie, a girl was, I don’t know, humping something, a pillow or whatever or maybe it was a light porn movie. I don’t remember. I think, what is she doing? And I was like, okay, I’m going to try that.

LEAH: Yeah. And so, did you get pleasure from that?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: Do you remember coming to something that you would now call an orgasm?

CARLA: Not at first. But it didn’t take too long for that to happen, yeah.

LEAH: Yeah. Was it something you did frequently?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: And was it something that you knew right away you needed to hide?

CARLA: Yeah. I would do it in bed when I was alone.

LEAH: Yeah. Did you have your own bedroom or were you sharing with a sibling?

CARLA: We were sharing at first, but I wasn’t doing anything at that age. And then, me and my sister had a big fight and my mom was done with us. So, she gave us our separate rooms.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Wow. So, you had some freedom in terms of exploring your body? You didn’t have to worry about others hearing you?

CARLA: I couldn’t lock my door because my mom said that, yeah, why should we lock our door? It’s our house, but she was paying the rent and so on. She was really, I don’t even know how to say it, she made the rules and we just had to listen. So, we couldn’t even close the door sometimes. And she was always in the house. She didn’t work. She was a stay-at-home mom. So, she would barge into your room just to stare at you and then walk away.

LEAH: Oh my goodness. It sounds like that was a challenging relationship for you.

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: Yeah. What did you learn about how to be a woman, how to be a wife from your mom?

CARLA: Nothing. She would tell us a lot of things, but it was like practice what I preach. So, she would do the opposite. She divorced my dad when I was around 12 years old. And the minute he was gone, she moved some guy in with us and he was horrible, yeah. And he would cheat on her. And I don’t know, there was so much tension that time. And my dad, he was a great guy. A real feminist. He really loved us. He was amazing. And I thought to myself, why did you leave my father for this guy? Yeah.

LEAH: Yeah. So, she didn’t talk to you about being a woman or being a wife. What did you learn from watching her? Maybe things you wanted to do, but also things you didn’t want to do?

CARLA: I wanted to be nothing like her, yeah. My sister has a best friend and I wanted to be like her mom. She was a such a sweet woman. And if I would ask my mom a question, depending on her mood, she would yell, scream or hit. And the friend would ask her mom something and she would sit her down and explain her things and I was like, wow, that’s what I want. Yeah.

LEAH: So, we haven’t gotten there yet, but I know you have five kids. I mean on any given day, but are you able, in general, to be the mother to them that you want to be?

CARLA: I hope so. I try really hard not to be like my mom because that really scares me and I didn’t like being at home growing up. And my children are always in the house, always near me. So, I do think they feel okay. They love being near me. And sometimes, when I’m tired or really angry, I can feel my mom the back of my head trying to come out and I have to really fight that because I don’t want that. Yeah.

LEAH: Do you have a relationship with her today?

CARLA: I do. But it’s really strained. And she has Alzheimer’s now. So, the bad things are coming back up and makes me feel like that little girl again, but I know she’s sick. But it makes me angry. So, I don’t visit her that much.

LEAH: Yeah, that’s hard. So hard. Yeah, I’m sorry.

CARLA: Thank you.

LEAH: So, when you were masturbating as a child or pre-teen, was it purely physical or were you fantasizing about things?

CARLA: No, it was physical. I was a really, really horny kid.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: It didn’t take long for me to cum. Maybe half a minute, yeah.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Wow. So, you weren’t watching a movie and doing it or reading a book like a sex scene or something and doing it?

CARLA: No, that came later because we weren’t allowed to watch those things. And she moved that guy in the house, I started discovering tapes with porn. And the people from my parents’ country, the men are mostly sailors. So, they have posters of nude women and everything is porn, books, posters, tapes, pictures.

And sometimes, my mom would say, “Go get me something in the, I don’t know, pantry.” And he would have a bag there with all those things and I would find myself going through it. And I was thinking, wow. And one time, I found a sex comic and I took it and I started reading and that’s when I started to fantasize about other things.

LEAH: Yeah. At what point did that fantasy turn into wanting to experiment with another person?

CARLA: Around 15, 16, yeah.

LEAH: Yeah. What was your first experience with another person?

CARLA: I was 15. It was with a guy I just met. I did it to make my mother angry because she was always like, “Hood girls don’t do this and you should go to school.” And I was going to school and I had good grades. I was always polite and I thought there’s nothing I can do. It will never be good enough for you.

LEAH: Yeah. And you said you had just met him. What made you decide this is the guy that you wanted to do this with?

CARLA: I thought he was cute. And that was it.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: And he was there.

CARLA: Yeah.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Was it fun?

CARLA: It wasn’t bad, but it wasn’t fun. And he was nice to me. It was okay. But it took me about six months or more to do it again with someone else. And that was much better and he was much nicer and I was in love that time. So, that made a difference.

LEAH: So, with the first guy, how far did you go? Was it penetrative sex or was it just fooling around?

CARLA: Penetrative sex, yeah.

LEAH: It was, okay. With the second guy, it was also penetrative sex?

CARLA: Yeah. No, he took his time, the second guy. He was really gentle and explaining stuff. The other guy, I don’t think he even believed it was my first time.

LEAH: Did you tell him it was your first time?

CARLA: No.

LEAH: Okay.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, he didn’t have a reason to think it was your first time?

CARLA: I thought I was such a woman doing that.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, with the second guy, you said it was more fun. Did you have pleasure?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: Yeah. What kind? From what kinds of activities were you having pleasure at that age?

CARLA: Kissing. And I still enjoy a good kisser and he was a really good kisser. And I have a thing for big men. So, he was big, tall, broad shoulders and everything. And he was funny. He would make me laugh with these stupid things.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: How long did things go on with him?

CARLA: Just a few weeks. I was on vacation in Canada.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Okay, nice. And so, then what happened next? Who was the next person you got involved with?

CARLA: I think I was 17. I just finished high school. It’s not the same as in the States. We have high school. Then before college, there’s something else, 4 years. I went there. And there was guy in class and he was like, “Wow, look at her.” And I thought to myself, what? I didn’t feel like talking to him. But that was my first real relationship. That lasted a few years. And we had good times, but also very bad times.

LEAH: How did you feel about your body?

CARLA: I always thought growing up that I was fat. But I was 40 pounds lighter than I am now.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: So, I wasn’t. When I look at my pictures when I was 12, I’m like, you weren’t fat. You were just a regular kid. But my mom would always stuff like that, “Look at your stomach. Look at this or look at that.” And now, at 45, I can still get very angry about it. So, I don’t like to talk about bodies around my children. I will never say, “Look at that big woman on TV.” I’m more like, “Look at her pretty smile or, I don’t know, nice hair,” stuff like that.

LEAH: Yeah. So, you felt like you were overweight or fat. How did that affect your ability to engage sexually with a man?

CARLA: In the dark. Just leave the lights off or keep a top on or something or underneath the covers.

LEAH: So, you didn’t want to be seen?

CARLA: No.

LEAH: Has that changed over time?

CARLA: Yeah. It took me a while. It’s not so long.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. Those messages do take a long time to work through. So, you said that was your first serious relationship. I don’t have a sense of when in here you met the father of your kids or if they all have the same father, I don’t know. I don’t know anything about your story.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: That’s okay.

LEAH: So, what happened next?

CARLA: I went to a party at one time. And my son, my oldest child has a different father. And I remember coming down the stairs and I knew him, I knew his face from around because I was always outside and just wandering in the city. And we started talking. We just had a fling. I wasn’t in love, but I thought he was cute and he’s cute. He’s a cute guy. And I wasn’t thinking. I was working in bars and stuff, living at night and sleeping during the day. And then, one time, I thought to myself, I haven’t had my period in a long time. And I’m feeling weird. Why am I always tired? So, I was 21 at the time. And I had my son.

LEAH: Did you ever consider not keeping the pregnancy or once you were pregnant, you were going to do it?

CARLA: No. I was just going to do it. I thought to myself, wow, I’m going to be a baby. I’m going to be a mom. I knew right from the beginning that he was a boy.

LEAH: Really?

CARLA: Yeah. And the dad, he was like, “No, I didn’t want to have a baby, blah, blah, blah.” And I thought, fine, I’ll do it by myself.

LEAH: Did you have support?

CARLA: Yeah, my family. My mom changed after I had my son.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. That seems to be the way. It’s really hard to be their child, but the grandchildren get everything.

CARLA: Yeah.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. So, that man was never a long-term partner, is that correct?

CARLA: No.

LEAH: Yeah. And so, were you okay with the idea of being a young single mom?

CARLA: Yeah, because my life changed. I went back to school. I got a degree. I started working. And then, when my son was 4 or 5, I met the father of my children and I was with him for 15 years. We got married and we had a great relationship. There were some things I thought I could handle, him having multiple relationships, but we would make agreements. So, if you have sex with someone, don’t bring her here and he did. He brought her to the wedding.

LEAH: He brought her to your wedding?

CARLA: I know.

LEAH: Good Lord.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: I didn’t know at the time. I found out later and by that time, we had bought a house. We had three children. And I think that was the beginning of the end. I just couldn’t take it anymore.

LEAH: So, would you have been okay if he had continued his relationship with her if the agreements had been kept, you think?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: So, it was the broken agreements and the broken trust. It wasn’t the relationship itself.

CARLA: Yeah, because every time he would bring a friend to the house, I was like, “Are you sure she’s a friend or are you just fucking her?”

LEAH: Yeah, sure. Broken trust, I think people have this idea that in open relationships or polyamory or however you describe your particular situation that that means you can’t cheat. No. You just have agreements, but they’re different than the monogamous agreements and you can absolutely still cheat and mess up your relationship and cause a lot of trauma for people.

CARLA: And he also lied because I’m not stupid. There were times I was like, “You are acting like a teenager around her like a boy when he sees boobs for the first time.” There was this big festival I wanted to go with him. And yeah, he went with her, then took him forever to go back home. And when he was home, he said, “Yeah, now we can go.” I didn’t feel like going anymore. And I just had my youngest daughter and I was feeling fat and not attractive at all. And he made me feel worse. So, I just didn’t go.

LEAH: Yeah. Was the open relationship open on both sides? Could you have had somebody else?

CARLA: Yeah, I could have. But I was either pregnant or breastfeeding. So, there was nothing happening.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Not really appealing.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Because I think there are times when men will say, “I want to open the relationship.” And what they mean is I want to go fuck other women, but you don’t get to do that same thing. So, it sounds like it would have been equitable if you’d wanted to.

CARLA: I don’t want to make him sound like a bad guy because as a father, he’s also a feminist. And I think it’s always for everyone, not just for him. But I don’t know. I don’t know if he could handle it, me being around other men because a lot of men are attracted to me. I don’t want to sound cocky or anything, but I don’t know. Everywhere I go, people are like, “You’re so beautiful. You’re sexy.” And I have a hard time believing it still. But I think if I wanted to, I could have had a lot of sex with other men.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: I want to invite you to imagine for a moment what your ideal sex life looks like and feels like. Who are you with? What type of sex do you have together? How do you feel while touching them and how does your body feel when they touch you? Or maybe you’d like to be having less sex than you’re currently having.

If you don’t know or if that vision of your ideal doesn’t look at all like what’s currently going on in your bedroom, I can help. With personalized sex and intimacy coaching, we’ll explore where you are, how you got here, where you want to be, and the steps to help you get there. There are no right or wrong answers, just the answers that work for you.

I understand that exploring your sexuality and all that goes with it, your body image, your belief in your lovability and more can be terrifying. Believe me. I sat in the middle of that fire for decades. I know how painful it is, but I also stepped out the other side stronger, more confident, and more certain of my lovability and desirability and I want the same for you.

I work with couples and one-on-one, whether you’ve never explored your sexual desires before or you want to explore things you’ve never done before like maybe BDSM or non-monogamy or if you and you partner need some help figuring out how to communicate together, so you can have better sex. I’m queer, kinky, and poly friendly and I want you to have a deeply fulfilling intimate life. Together, we can help you get there.

For more information and to schedule your free discovery call, visit www.leahcarey.com/coaching. A new client recently said that before her discovery call, she was extremely nervous, but that I made the experience feel easy and comfortable. So, book your free discovery call today at www.leahcarey.com/coaching.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: So, you’ve had five children. Five pregnancies. I don’t want to make assumptions. Okay. So, you’ve had five pregnancies. How has your experience of sex changed since having kids?

CARLA: I’m now more vocal about what I want and how I want it. My youngest is with my partner now and I don’t think a lot has changed because I still enjoy sex the way I’ve always had. So, I don’t think much lots have changed because from the beginning, if someone would do something I didn’t like or I remember one time having sex with a guy. And he was like, “You came because you’re wet.” And I was like, “No, I didn’t.” And he was like, “Yeah.” What? We would have a discussion. I was like, “You don’t get to tell me how my body works because I know how it feels.”

LEAH: Yeah. And did your sensation in your body change at all or did you have different vaginal sensations after having given birth?

CARLA: Yeah, vaginal orgasms have changed.

LEAH: Yeah. In what way?

CARLA: It’s not as powerful as they used to be. So, I think I have to do some Kegels or something.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Is it still pleasurable?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: You were with your ex-husband I think you said for 15 years. That relationship ended and now you have your current partner. What is your relationship with your current partner like?

CARLA: It’s different. He was someone I knew from when I was a teenager and he always had a thing for me. But he’s a few years younger than me. And at the age of 15, I thought, I’m a woman and you’re a little boy. He was cute.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: But after my father died, he showed up. He helped with cleaning the house. He didn’t ask for anything and he was never a creep or anything. He was always very polite, very nice to me. And at one time, he saw a picture of me on Facebook and he sent me a message. He’s like, “Are you okay?” I said, “Yeah, my dad died.” He said, “Yeah, I know. So, can I take you out to coffee?” And that was the first time when I looked at him, I was like, when did you turn into a man? What happened?

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: Yeah. And I didn’t know he was smoking. So, he had a Marlboro package of cigarettes that he started smoking. I was like, oh my god.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: But nothing happened that day because I was still married and he was in a relationship, but our relationship from both ends were ending. So, it took him a few months. And then, he sent me a message, “Yeah, would you like to go for a cup of coffee?” And I said, “Yeah, sure.” But I asked him, “How are you and your lady?” He said, “Yeah, it’s not going good. We’re breaking up.” And I was also heading towards divorce. And by that time, I thought, it’s now or never.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. So, it sounds like you got together with him pretty quickly upon the ending of your marriage?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: And how was the sex?

CARLA: It’s awesome. Yeah, he’s so different. And at first, I was like, “If you want to, we could have an open relationship.” And he’s like, “No. I just want you and I want you all for me.” And okay, that’s good. And he’s the type of man he shows me he’s really into me and he’s like a teenager sometimes. He can get hard at any time.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: And I’m not used to that. With my ex, it will take him forever to cum and blame me. He wouldn’t say, it’s your fault, but I just thought it was my fault. I wasn’t good enough. I wasn’t tight enough or maybe my boobs weren’t perky enough. And I can make him cum and I’m really happy about that.

LEAH: Yeah. You said that the two of you don’t live together. So, how is that for you to have a serious committed relationship that sounds like it’s long-term, you share a child, how is that for you to have that in separate homes?

CARLA: He’s here a lot because he works nearby. So, with his son, because of our custody agreements, I can’t move far away and I don’t want that for my children. I want them to be near their father. And so, he works nearby. So, I do see him regularly almost daily. And when my children are with their father, I go to his house.

LEAH: So, just to clarify, is your oldest son still at home?

CARLA: He’s at home, but he’s 24 now.

LEAH: Okay. So, when you say my children are with their father, does that include him?

CARLA: No, just the girls. Yeah.

LEAH: Okay. So, there are three girls in the middle who go to their father’s. And then, what about your son who you share with your current partner?

CARLA: He’s with me full-time. But his dad is almost every day there.

LEAH: I love hearing about this because so many people think that there’s only one way to do relationship and child rearing and that is you get a house together, you get married, you live together. You have a kid and you do everything as a family. This is another perfectly viable way of having a family unit as long as it works for you.

CARLA: Yeah. I really like it this way because I like being with my children. And I remember when my dad left and that man came into our house, he was there all the time. And I have a teenage daughter and I want her to feel free in our house. So, maybe I’ll wait until, I don’t know, she’s a grown up when we finally get a house together. But for now, I don’t know. She likes him, so she says. I’m not sure.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: But yeah, I just want her to feel at home. And she likes being with me, but she doesn’t like it at his house. So, I don’t want to force her into anything.

LEAH: So, it sounds like the two of you keeping separate homes is situational as opposed to like, I never want to live together.

CARLA: I’m scared of living together because you don’t know what can happen. What if this fails again? I have to move again. Find another house again.

LEAH: Yeah, sure. And how long have the two of you been together?

CARLA: 5 years now.

LEAH: So, that’s a serious committed relationship. How old is your youngest?

CARLA: He’s 2.

LEAH: And how old is your next oldest?

CARLA: 7.

LEAH: So, were you expecting to have another pregnancy?

CARLA: I wanted to because I had two miscarriages before, but I was also over 40 and people are like, “You’re old now.”

LEAH: Geriatric pregnancy.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: Yeah. I was like, “A geri what?”

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: But that’s how they treated me also. My children, all my deliveries have been really quick and I’ve had good pregnancies. With my youngest, his delivery was shorter. And I wanted to have him at home, but they’re like, “No, you’re old. And there’s something going on, so you need to go to the hospital.”

LEAH: Before we started, I asked you what your orientation is and you said straight, but you find women attractive. And I said, would you consider yourself heteroflexible? And you said, yes. So, I’m curious. Have you had any experiences with women? How far does that go for you?

CARLA: Not much. I kissed a woman once. You’d think living in Amsterdam, there would be women all over the place, but I don’t know where to find them. So, I just go with the flow. And I’ve been to a party with a friend of mine and there were a lot of women into women there. And one woman came up to me and she gave me an air kiss. And I was like, “Oh my god. Did you see that?”

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: So, that was nice, but nothing much happened. And the women were so nice. They were like, “You look gorgeous. Look at you and your beautiful, blah, blah, blah.” And it was nice. And she asked me, “Would you like to come to a party?” And I was like, “Yeah, sure.”

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: So, I’m open minded. If something happens, it’ll happen. And my partner’s like, “Sure, go ahead.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: So, you’ve kissed another woman, but that’s as far as it’s gone for you?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: Do you have curiosity about it or just if it happens, it happens?

CARLA: I’m curious. I would like to know how it feels like to be with a woman.

LEAH: So, you mentioned that in the Netherlands, sexual attitudes are more liberal than they are here in the US. Can you talk a little bit about what that means? This is also based on how much you know about the US.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah, I’m curious to know how you experience sexuality and attitudes about sex there?

CARLA: When I was young, there was this deodorant commercial. And there’s a woman running around a beach just in a tiny underwear, just a thong. And that was it. There were boobs on TV all the time and pubic hairs and stuff like that. And even penises, naked butts.

LEAH: And this is all on public television, freely available television?

CARLA: Yeah. There was also a show, I think it’s French, it was a cartoon about the body. And there’s a scene where a woman gives birth and they had a cartoon vagina with a baby coming out. So, yeah, and if you would go swimming in public pools and stuff, there would be women topless. It wasn’t weird to us.

LEAH: Yeah. And that’s still how it is?

CARLA: Not so much I think because it has to do with cellphones. People are taking pictures and posting them everywhere, so there are still if you’re young and your boobs are perky, you will see them on the beach.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: And I’ve been in other countries like Spain, Gran Canaria, and there are women there, moms, who would go topless, but I haven’t seen them in the Netherlands at all for a long time.

LEAH: Yeah. Am I correct that sex work is legal in the Netherlands?

CARLA: I believe it is. There are places where they can work. There’s a red-light district. Almost everyone knows about that and there are houses and strip clubs. So, after getting arrested, they’re probably doing it somewhere where they shouldn’t be.

LEAH: And is sex work stigmatized?

CARLA: Not as much as other countries because when I was a teen, there was this place I would go out to dance. And there was a zone where the hookers were. And on my way to the disco, I would run into those women. And yeah, I was dressed like them. I wore hot pants and a top and I would be like, “Hey, girls.” And they would be like, “Hey.”

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: They took away the zone from them and put them somewhere else where it was really unsafe for them near the harbors and it was dark and lots of things were happening there. So, that wasn’t good. But I didn’t think much of them. It wasn’t that when I saw a hooker, I’d be like, “Oh my god, you’re such a dirty woman. You’ll burn in hell forever.” I don’t know. They were just people to me.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: I get so many messages from listeners saying, “Thank you for the show. I’ve listened to the whole back catalog and it’s helped me completely transform my sex life.” Are you one of those people? If so, I’d love to have your support, so I can keep growing this show and bringing a new vision of sexuality to the world.

If you haven’t done it yet, please take a moment to rate and review this podcast. I know the podcast industry does not make reviewing a show easy. So, go to www.ratethispodcast.com/goodgirls and it should lead you through the process of posting a review. I’d love to get 100 reviews by the end of the year and I could use your help.

And if you have the financial resources to support the sex positive work I do, I’d be so grateful for your support at Patreon. Donating the equivalent of a fancy cup of coffee each month might not make a big difference to you, but it makes a huge difference to me. There’s no contract or obligation. You can cancel it anytime. And I donate 10% of all proceeds to ARC-Southeast, an organization that supports women in the Southeast United States to access reproductive services that are now either illegal or heavily legislated.

It’s easy to become a patron at www.patreon.com/goodgirlstalkaboutsex. And speaking of Patreon, there is a treasure trove of additional audio at Patreon that’s free for everyone to listen to. You don’t even need to have a Patreon account to access it. Just go to www.patreon.com/goodgirlstalkaboutsex to start listening.

I appreciate every one of you whether you’re a client, a contributor, a social media follower or a silent listener. I trust you to know what’s right for you. Thank you for being here. Now, let’s get back to the show!

[MUSIC]

LEAH: And now, it’s time for the lowdown, the things we’re dying to know but would usually be too polite to ask any good girl.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: Do you have sex during your period?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: What’s the approximate number of sex partners you’ve had?

CARLA: I don’t remember, but I think it’s way over 30, 50 maybe.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: How old were you when you began masturbating?

CARLA: I don’t know, maybe 10, 11, 12-ish. Around that time, yeah.

LEAH: Have you ever had sex with someone of a different racial identity than your own?

CARLA: Yeah, lots of times.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: My guess is it’s different in Europe I would imagine than it is here in the States.

CARLA: Yeah. I’m not sure.

LEAH: I think it’s still stigmatized here in the States a lot, yeah. What’s your favorite sex toy?

CARLA: I don’t have one. But there was it’s shaped like an egg then you insert it and you’ll have sex. And so, you both feel it move around. So, I think it’s that one. But I haven’t used a toy forever. Yeah, it’s been a long time.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you prefer to initiate or for your partner to initiate in the bedroom?

CARLA: Both, yeah.

LEAH: What’s your favorite sex position?

CARLA: Missionary because I like looking at him and smell him, kiss him, touch him. And I can tell when he’s about to cum and stuff like that. Also, cowgirl, is that how you call it? When I’m on top?

LEAH: You’re on top, yeah.

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: Are you generally more active or more passive during lovemaking?

CARLA: Active. We’re both very active, yeah.

LEAH: Do you prefer clit stimulation or penetration?

CARLA: Penetration.

LEAH: Do you enjoy G-spot stimulation?

CARLA: I’m not sure I have one.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: I cum so quick, so I don’t know.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you have to work to keep yourself from orgasming or do you just let yourself go?

CARLA: I can’t stop it. And sometimes, he can just go in and I’ll cum. I’m like, what?

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: And so, once that has happened, are you a multiple orgasmer or a one and done?

CARLA: One and done. I just want to sleep. And sometimes, we’ll go on and it will take fifteen minutes before I reach another orgasm. But I’ve never had a multiple one.

LEAH: Is that pleasurable for you after you have an orgasm to continue with penetrative sex?

CARLA: No, because everything is sensitive. So, I’ll just tell him, “We can continue, but don’t touch my nipples. Don’t touch my shoulder. Just lay there for a minute.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Good. So, you know what works for you. That’s awesome. I love it.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. The next question is do you think it’s generally easy or challenging for you to orgasm?

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: I wish I was slower with it.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you enjoy having your breasts played with?

CARLA: Yeah.

LEAH: Have you ever faked an orgasm?

CARLA: No.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: You don’t need to, it sounds like.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: If I refused, men, boys, when it just didn’t work and I was not going to stroke their ego by faking it.

LEAH: Yeah. Do you prefer the orgasm from masturbating or from sex with another person?

CARLA: Sex with another person.

LEAH: What’s your favorite thing to do to your partner during sexual play?

CARLA: He likes it when I stroke him and it doesn’t matter where. He just likes to feel my hands on his body.

LEAH: So, you just answered what does he like you to do? My question is what do you like to do?

CARLA: Sorry.

LEAH: No, that’s a very common thing for us to do as women.

CARLA: Yeah. I also enjoy touching him because he’s a big guy, but also very muscular. So, I’ll just lay beside him in the dark, and then feel his muscles. And that’s very arousing for me. So, there are people that will go straight for the balls or his dick, but that’s not how I work. I really enjoy touching him, yeah.

LEAH: What kind of touch do you enjoy receiving most?

CARLA: He’s not too fond of kissing. So, when he misses me, I really enjoyed it.

LEAH: What are your hard red lines, the things you definitely don’t want to do?

CARLA: I’ll try anything, but I won’t do anything illegal. Anything else, I’ll try.

LEAH: What is illegal?

CARLA: Let’s say I would meet a guy and he says, “I’m into kiddie porn.” I’d be like, “Nope. Get away from me,” stuff like that. But other things, he says, “I bought these handcuffs, would you like to try them?” I’d be like, “Yeah, sure. I’ll try. I’ll give it a go.”

LEAH: Yeah, okay. What about piss and poop?

CARLA: I think that’s where I draw the line.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: I’d consider pee, but poop, nope.

LEAH: Yeah, okay. How do you feel about porn?

CARLA: I like porn every now and then. When I was pregnant with my youngest, I was really into porn. I was horny all the time. So, I’d watch porn when I was alone.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: What’s your ideal frequency for sex?

CARLA: A few times a week, at least three times a week.

LEAH: Do you have hair down there or are you bare?

CARLA: I have hair.

LEAH: Is that common? What is the norm if there is such a thing in the Netherlands?

CARLA: Growing up, I was used to seeing women with pubic hairs and I think it’s something maybe 20 years, between 30 and 20 years, that a lot of women are shaving and I used to. And then, I started waxing and I remember watching a picture of Amber Rose posing not nude, she had a bra on, but no panties and she had pubes. And I was like, that’s so pretty. It looks so beautiful. And I thought to myself, why am I going through this? Why am I always shaving? So, I did trim and I just waxed the sides. But I like pubic hair. I like hairy men.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: I think it’s beautiful. So, I choose to keep it.

LEAH: Yeah. Have you ever had a threesome or more?

CARLA: No. I wish I had.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Yeah. Do you enjoy giving blowjobs?

CARLA: I do, yeah.

LEAH: Do you swallow?

CARLA: No. It has happened once or twice.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: What do you do instead?

CARLA: I just spit it out. Yeah, I always have a napkin or something.

LEAH: Do you enjoy receiving oral sex?

CARLA: I do, but it’s so sensitive down there. I will always tell a guy, “Before you go down there, first of all, you can’t lick me with the tip of your tongue. You can’t put your nose in there because it’s sensitive. It’s like stabbing.” So, I tell, “You have to use your tongue, the middle part of it, not the tip of your tongue.” So, there’s a lot of instructions before they go down there.

LEAH: Yeah. Do you ever worry about your smell or taste?

CARLA: Not anymore.

LEAH: How do you feel about ass play?

CARLA: I’m into it. I do enjoy it, yeah.

LEAH: Giving and receiving?

CARLA: I haven’t done it to my partner. We’ll talk about anything expect that because it’s not something I think I need to do to have a fulfilling sex life. If he’d ask me to do it, I’d probably would.

LEAH: What do you consider the “kinkiest” thing you enjoy with the understanding that everyone has a completely different scale of kink?

CARLA: Maybe soft S&M. I haven’t really done anything “kinky.”

LEAH: Yeah. But spanking, is that what you mean by soft S&M?

CARLA: Yeah. I do enjoy that and maybe a little choking.

LEAH: Okay. And what’s your safety protocol for choking?

CARLA: I only do it with people who I really trust, yeah.

LEAH: Okay. So, people who listen to this podcast regularly have heard me go on this particular train several times, but I will always say it again. Choking is one of the most high-risk activities you can do during sex. It doesn’t mean you shouldn’t do it. But you do need to be really aware of the consequences and when things go wrong, they go really wrong really fast. And it doesn’t matter how much you trust each other.

So, you and your partner, if you do this together, should have a conversation about if something goes wrong, what is our safety protocol? Calling the emergency services, whatever it is that makes you feel like this is what safety is. And then, I really recommend writing it on a piece of paper or an index card and putting it by the bed or wherever you have sex so that if something goes wrong and you or your partner gets totally freaked out, you don’t have to remember what the protocol was. You can just pick up that and look at it and do it, so yeah.

CARLA: That’s a good tip, yeah.

LEAH: I’m glad you like it.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: Yeah, because I’ve heard them always talk about it and I haven’t done it a lot. And yeah, my partner, he has really big hands and he’s really strong, so I could imagine things going bad really, really fast.

LEAH: Yeah. And it’s not because they’re trying to hurt you. It’s not because of anything that they are intentionally doing. They might think they’re doing exactly the same thing they’ve done ten times before, but for whatever reason on that day, things go wrong because we’re talking about your breath and your blood and that’s stuff you just have to be really careful with.

CARLA: Yeah, okay.

LEAH: Okay. I will now step down off of my soap box.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Do you enjoy dirty talk during sex?

CARLA: Yeah, I do.

LEAH: Do you enjoy laughter during sex?

CARLA: Yeah. We have lots of fun.

LEAH: Have you ever felt a sexual urge that confused you?

CARLA: Yeah. It still feels weird to me because my son is 2 and I’m still breastfeeding. So, sometimes, I’ll feed him, and then he’ll go to bed. And I’ll have sex with his dad and he’ll suck on my breasts and it’s just so confusing for me. I’ll be like, no, no, no. This is for the baby. But I do enjoy it. Or sometimes, after sex, my son will wake up and he wants to feed. And I’m like, oh my god. I can’t just feed you right now. Yeah, it’s really weird.

LEAH: I think that’s a common experience for moms who are breastfeeding to have that like, who is this for right now? Yeah.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: That’s something you don’t hear women talk about.

LEAH: That’s so true. Yeah, I’m glad you said it. What’s your favorite part of your body?

CARLA: My stomach. I’ve learned to love her.

LEAH: Wow, I love that. That’s awesome.

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: What’s your least favorite part of your body?

CARLA: Let me think.

[LAUGHTER]

CARLA: I don’t think I have one. I’ve finally accepted myself.

LEAH: Yeah, I love it. What is something about your current sex life that isn’t quite as satisfying as you’d like it to be?

CARLA: I would like for my partner to kiss me more. He’s just not a kisser and I really miss that and there are times I think he feels that when we’re about to have sex, he’ll kiss me and makes me feel emotional sometimes.

LEAH: Do you ask him for more kissing and making out?

CARLA: Yeah. Sometimes, I’ll ask him, “Kiss me for 10 seconds then.” And he’s like, “Okay.”

[LAUGHTER]

LEAH: Okay. What belief did you have about sex as a child or teenager that you wish you could go back and correct her on now?

CARLA: That it was bad. I remember watching The Blue Lagoon. And when she had the baby and they had sex and I didn’t know what was going on, but I knew what they were doing was bad.  And so, I was also very judgmental about certain things before I changed. So, I wish I could go back and be like, we need to accept people for who they are and everybody’s different. So, you’re not bad for having sex for doing those things.

LEAH: Yeah, I love it. Carla, thank you so much for having this conversation with me. It has been such a joy to talk with you.

CARLA: I was really looking forward to this. I’ve been listening to your podcast nonstop.

LEAH: Now, you will get to hear your voice.

CARLA: I’m looking forward to it. I’ve told everyone that I was going to be hopefully on your podcast and they’re like, “Send me the link when you’re done.” I said, “Yes, I will.”

LEAH: Excellent. Awesome.

[MUSIC]

LEAH: That’s it for today. Before we go, I want to remind you that the things you may have heard about your sexuality aren’t true. You are worthy. You are desirable. You are not broken. As a sex and intimacy coach, I will guide you in embracing the sexuality that is innately yours, not matter what it looks like.

To set up your free discovery call, go to www.leahcarey.com/coaching. If you have questions or comments about anything you’ve heard on the show, call and leave a message at 720-GOOD-SEX. Full show notes and transcripts for this episode are at www.goodgirlstalk.com. And you can follow me @goodgirlstalk on the socials for more sex positive content. If you’re enjoying this, please take a moment to leave a 5-star rating and review on Apple Podcasts or if you’re using another podcast app, go to www.ratethispodcast.com/goodgirls.

While listening to this show is free, producing is not. If my work is meaningful to you and you have a few dollars to support it each month, I’ll gratefully accept your patronage at Patreon. Find out more and become a community member at www.patreon.com/goodgirlstalkaboutsex.

Good Girls Talk About Sex is produced by me, Leah Carey, and edited by Gretchen Kilby. I have additional administrative support from Lara O’Connor. Transcripts are produced by Jan Acielo. Until next time, here’s to your better sex life!

[MUSIC]

Support the show:

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I’ve done this because not everyone has the means to pay for access, and I know this additional material can be deeply important for some listeners. But creating this show isn’t free, so if you’d like to support the work I do, I am grateful for your contributions at www.patreon.com/goodgirlstalkaboutsex.

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Notable quotables

Everywhere I go, people tell me I am beautiful. But I have a hard time believing it.

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As I get older, I’m more vocal about what I want and how I want it.

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I was a really horny kid.

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Growing up, my mom would get angry if I got curious about something sexual on TV and tell me, “Good girls don’t ask those things.”

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I was feeling fat and unattractive after having our daughter. His cheating made me feel worse.

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I don’t like to talk negatively about bodies around my children. I’ll never say, “Oh, look at that big woman on TV.” I’m more like, “Look at her pretty smile. Look at her nice hair.”

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